carbs: exercise headaches and nausea + disrupted sleep

[monique]

This last month I experienced terrible headaches and nausea after exercising. Yesterday I started eating more carbs before and during and after exercise. The headache is a lot less, no nausea, but (today) the day after I feel slow and lethargic. The carbs I ate were pumpkin-pie (made of grated pumpkin with chestnut flour and coconut oil/olive oil/cultured ghee...yammie...;-)) and fried green plantain.
Is the headache a result of being too low carb or not being quite in ketosis? What is this dynamic to get headaches after exercise (first time for me in combination with exercise. I have been AIP since febr '14 .Although I experienced migraines before I cut the plain sugar now 2 years ago)
I experimented with being in ketosis in july and august but this disrupted my sleep more. I have read Sarah's blogs on carb intake. I wrestle with carb's a lot. If I eat too many (like this rule of thirds with every meal) I gain weight and my gut feels horrible and I feel a light flaring of lower back pain (which is part of my gut feeling horrible) If I eat lower carbs I feel great but then I get these horrible headaches after exercising, which I did not get in the beginning of AIP.
My sleep is disrupted anyway (higher carbs or lower carbs) and that is an issue too. Are headaches/nausea/disrupted sleep linked with the intake of carbs?

[maren]

I would be interested too and am calling out to Katherine who is the ultimate carbs expert. I have always wondered how AIP-compatible carbs/starches/resistant starch really are. E.g. I do seem to react to rice and potatoes and maniok/yucca. In any case, do adjust yourself to carbs/starches s l o w l y!

[monique]

HI Maren, thanks for your calling out the troops!
I was recovering yesterday by eating the rest of the pumpkin-pie and another full fried green plantain....no veggies, just a little meat, it felt great and I slept better than I had in days....and today I feel great again.
While recovering I spent a lot of time quantifying carbs with the help of chriskresser.com/are-you-lower-carb-than-you-think and nutritiondata.self.com/.
It took me awhile to grasp the basics of this carb counting in the nutritiondata.com. and I am still awed by the complexity.
I get the feeling that although I thought I was quite high carb, I wasn't. just like Frank the Swat guy of Chris Kesser...;-))
Thank you for the warning to adjust slowly, Maren! I will. Parsnip eg especially roasted in coconuoil, and then eaten cold gives me straight away brainfog and an upset gut. have no idea why.
I got cassave for the first time and will try a little later this week.
That's why I thought ketosis might be good idea for my body: Since going AIP I have never had issues with fat or protein or green veggies. Only some starchlike carbs which give me trouble: figuring out which one and what amount to eat.......WOW sooo much counting and registering
Anyway....we'll get there. just have to keep moving...;-)
I am interested in Katherine's opinion!
All the Best
Monique

[monique]

www.paleoplan.com/2011/06-07/paleo-for-the-active-person/
"If you’re an active person – that could include anyone from a city dweller who walks 5 miles a day to someone who’s training for a marathon – you may just need more carbohydrates if you’re failing on the Paleo diet. For myself, I’ve figured out that I MUST have a dense source of carbs in the morning. I can’t just have eggs and meat and some leafy vegetables or 45 minutes later I’m hungry and low blood sugar. And if you start your day out with a blood sugar crash, you’re not doing anything good for your energy for the rest of the day, your sleep patterns or your weight loss goals"

the day I ate just carbs, the pumpkin pie and green plantain, I slept sooo much better!
I'll try this eating carbs in the morning today to see if I sleep better tonight......if anyone can explain the dynamics behind this?

[EJ]

monique, I also was amazed by that Chris Kresser article. But I'm not sure how to apply it to my life, either...

I guess it's all just part of the "fun" experimentation we have to do to find our ideals

[TamarE]

I don't think Katherine visits this site very often, but I'll send her the link to this post.

[monique]

Thanks Tamar!
the experiment with eating carbs early in the morning to help you sleep better (see link paleoplan) did not work for me at all. Although I did some exercise in the morning, I spend the whole night awake instead ....and I can laugh about it now.....Anyway
here's another clue I found:
www.paleoforwomen.com/carbohydrates-for-fertility-and-health/
"Vegetables of course are great, but they do not count for carbohydrate consumption. I know that much of carbohydrate content is indeed processed as glucose, but much of it is also tied up in fiber, which is broken down and turned into short-chain fatty acids by gut bacteria. For this reason, vegetables alone cannot make up a woman’s carbohydrate consumption. Instead, starchy tubers and low-fructose fruits work the best. Moreover, carbohydrates taken later in the day help with insulin sensitivity (since that gives the body the longest amount of time throughout a 24 hour period to operate at low insulin and leptin levels). They also, anecdotally, help put people to sleep"

Yesterday my carbs existed primarily of pumpkin, but that is not "carby" enough according to Stefani and Diane. So that might be the reason of yet another sleepless night (waking feeling famished although I ate a good dinner, having to urinate, eating fried plantain, sleeping a bit, waking.....well you get the picture...;-))
So today I have been eating little bits of boiled cassave, to add starch slow and no work out
+ some dried dates from Diane's advice :http://balancedbites.com/2011/08/paleo-diet-carbs.html
I wonder what the night brings, actually no I do not wonder....I want to be sound asleep....;-))
GIRLS THANK YOU!!

[monique]

After a week of bad days and nights I now feel I am taking part in the world again........that is very nice.
GP did bloodtests iron, thyroid and diabetes. All is well.... apart that I felt sick.....;-))
Anyway I told GP it might be lack of starch ("uhuhh"..blank face from GP...;-))
This week I incorporated cassave or boiled rice (one tablespoon with each meal) + pumpkin pie (with chestnut flour) and 3-4 dates per day.
The week progressed with each day more sleep and less "feeling electrified" and wanting to eat and urinate at night.
I have not done any exercise yet. If I sleep this well next week I'll take some exercise and see how everything goes.
What I find strange (or perhaps that's plain logic??) is that my sugar-cravings have completely gone after that experiment with ketogenic diet. I have never experienced that ever!
So good thing from a " bad" thing?!

[monique]

......wakefull night after a day were I ate...uhh grazed... mostly carbs from home-made crackers (containing sunflower- and pumpkinseeds and boiled rice) and pumpkin pie. We ran out of veggies and meat on a sunday + to have some fresh food my husband and I walked to a seaside cafetaria and back (about 1,5 hours total. I had a nice shrimp/crab green-salad. My husband a Belgian beer and a big stack of fried potatoe-chips with lots of mayonaise...very "fresh" ....hahaha)
Guess what: no sleep. until I took probiotics at 5 in the morning. Slept like a baby till 9 am.
Two things which might play a role, I guess, to a wakeful night: walking early evening (we were back at 19.00) and too many carbs during the day/evening...I kept grazing after the salad......
Both of these,I experienced before, might keep me wakefull (if I analyse correctly)
Anyone shedding light on the dynamics?

[paleoprincess]

Slow and lethargic, feeling electrified, headaches, nausea, wanting to eat and urinate, blood sugar imbalances, disrupted sleep (especially in the evening), not being able to exercise - these are all classic symptoms of Adrenal Fatigue. What else is happening in your life?

[monique]

Hello Paleoprincess, Brooke, thank you for posting this analysis! You are right, I feel! I saw another post of you under ketosis were you mentioned ketosis worked good for you. I hope you feel better, by the way.
AF is just soo weird, I have a feeling it became worse for me after going low carb. Fat is great for me, cultured ghee, lard tallow, coconut oil......it all works great. It's the balance of carbs which make my body a mess. I eat as much (green,colored) veggies as I can, grassfed meat and organ meat, bonebroths.
The nausea and headaches after exercising isn't something that I recognize from before I started AIP, that is very new. My health improved so much since AIP (febr 14) Disrupted sleep slow and lethargic, yes from before. Lots of other symptoms: uveitis, heavy menstrual cycles, migraines...all the boring stuff....:-))
Why didn't the bloodtest come back showing blood-sugar imbalance?
Do you have some guidelines?
Can AF be healed and how?
Thanks for your time!
All the best!
Monique

[EJ]

Here's a good post: robbwolf.com/2012/04/09/real-deal-adrenal-fatigue/

I don't know about blood tests...but I would go with how you feel rather than what numbers you have.

[monique]

Hello EJ
Thanks for the RobbWolf thread.
"but I would go with how you feel rather than what numbers you have" really good advice thanks!

Since going AIP endometriosis, uveitis, inflamed lower back, nausea, brainfog, fatigue and other smaller stuff have gone......out of the window....unbelievably....Yes!
So I was surprised by the hit of severe headaches and nausea after exercising, suddenly one night not long ago and then a few times after that night again after I exercised (paddling in a kayak on the sea....sooo wonderful)

July and august I went quite low carb: it did not work for me at all: that was the basis of feeling electrified at night (again, like before AIP, only stronger now)
In middle of sept I started eating more starchy veggies and now more starchy roots like cassave.....perhaps being low carb for over 2 months and exercising were the trigger for the headaches?

Good quality sleep slowly improved after adopting AIP, not greatly but I had a 50/50 of good nights and bad nights (before AIP 1 night a week of good sleep at the most)
Since the headaches I am again very sensitive again to sleeplessness.
I do think I have adrenal issues now but I do not believe I have adrenal fatigue somehow.
Even after a sleepless night (like now) I have energy, no sugar-cravings, hardly no brainfog (not as before) Yes I do feel it in my body and mind that I did not get a good sleep.
So adrenal issues : yes.
But mostly I believe it is carb intake: the night after reply 8 I had my carbs really finely tuned...I slept 9 hours in one go, guess I was also very tired but even with being tired.......that is a very rare thing....and quite precious.
I kept the carbs in the next day (yesterday) and added one extra spoon...(one too many ? ) in the evening meal: a no-sleep night.
That is my most sensitive meal too: the evening meal.

I've just come back from 1 hours walk. Waiting how my body will react.....(as if my own laboratory...;-)

In short: I believe my recent adrenal/hormonal? /neurotransmitter-serotonine?/ issues are part of the carb intake.
Does this make sense somehow?

[EJ]

Yes, it makes sense. And yes, we are our own science projects I hope you can figure out the right equation so you can sleep and feel good-and soon!

[monique]

The last few days I ate a bigger amount of "plain" starch at breakfast and lunch and just a couple tablespoons in evening, about 100/150 grammes total: either boiled cassave or brown rice. (Of course..;-)) together with a big amount of veggies and meat/fish + fat.
Exercise slowly increasing from a few yoga exercises to 1 hr bike ride at a fair speed.
No headaches, sleeping better, no brain fog.
Sigh of relief......food is a powerful tool but the feedback from this community even more!
THANKS!!
I Find this carb thing interesting though so anyone finding science behind it and wanting to share it: great!
I read so much about low-carb miracles perhaps I was too " infected" by that + unwittingly thinking I was pretty high carb until I measured it with nutritiondata.com
in Dutch we have a saying...measuring is knowing, but knowing is more than measuring
All the best!
Monique